WHEN YOU THINK OF MECCAS FOR JAZZ, THE CITIES OF NEW YORK, CHICAGO AND NEW ORLEANS COME TO MIND FOR AMERICA, WITH LOS ANGELES A DISTANT FOURTH.
HOWEVER, AFTER TRAVELING AROUND THE STATES, I HAVE LEARNED THAT THERE ARE POCKETS THERE THERE IS FERTILE GROUND FOR MODERN JAZZ. LAST YEAR WE DISCUSSED MINNEAPOLIS, AND THIS TIME AROUND THE STATE OF TENNESSEE, MOST PARTICULARLY KNOXVILLE, IS GETTING A REPUTATION AS AN UP AND COMING AREA FOR JAZZ EDUCATION AND PERFORMANCE.
WHILE USUALLY KNOWN FOR CLASS V WHITEWATERS, BLUEGRASS, CIVIL WAR BATTLEFIELDS AND TORNADOS, TENNESSEE HAS SLOWLY CREATED A JAZZ SCENE.
IT CAME ABOUT FROM DISPARATE DIRECTIONS, ONE FROM VINCE THOMPSON A TRANSPLANT JAZZ EDUCATOR WHO SAW A MUSICAL NEED AND FILLED IT BEYOND ORIGINAL SCOPE, AND THE OTHER FROM A MEMBER OF THE FAMED JAZZ MESSENGERS, PIANIST DONALD BROWN, WHO SAW JAZZ EDUCATION AS A LOGICAL FINAL DESTINATION FOR HIS CAREER.
WE HAD A CHANCE TO LET THESE TWO GENTS TAKE SOME TIME TO DISCUSS THE GOOD, BAD AND UGLY ABOUT JAZZ EDUCATION, AND JAZZ AS A CAREER. AS EXPECTED, THESE MEN HAVE LOTS TO TEACH.
VANCE,WHAT MADE YOU WANT TO START UP THE KNOXVILLE JAZZ ORCHESTRA?
VANCE: I had several different motivations.
My biggest one-I had had been living in Chicago, and there were a lot of opportunities to both play with and write for some really good big bands. When I moved back to Knoxville, there wasn’t an outlet for me to plug into.
But when I looked around and realized that we had enough players around to have a good band there, I felt that I knew what I had to do. (laughs)
If I wanted to keep doing what I wanted to do, someone had to organize it
VANCE, WAS IT DIFFICULT TO ROUND UP AND MOTIVATE ENOUGH PEOPLE TO GIVE IT A TRY?
VANCE: No. There were a lot of excellent players, and they didn’t have any other outlet to do this, either. It’s fun to play in a big band, so everyone that I talked to said “yes”, and almost everyone that came to the first rehearsal stayed with it. One guy couldn’t justify to his family doing something for free, as we didn’t have any money to pay him.
But within a couple of rehearsals our membership was pretty much set. Now, twenty years later, 12 of the original 16 are still with us.
VANCE, IS THE ORCHESTRA PART OF THE SCHOOL SYSTEM?
VANCE: No. There were several of us that taught at UT, but we’ve never been affiliated with the university or the public school system.
VANCE: WHAT DO YOU TEACH AT THE UNIVERSITY?
VANCE: When I started, they hired me to just give a few trumpet lessons and teach Big Band Arranging. As time has gone on I’ve added more classes. I also teach Jazz Styles, Trombone, The History of Jazz, and a Music Business class.
VANCE: WHAT DO YOU TEACH IN THE MUSIC BUSINESS CLASS?
VANCE: I get a wide range of students from all over the university. Some are musicians; some are not. I use it as an intro to many of the different ways that people can make money in music.
For my part of the class, I will teach things that are relevant to what I do with the Knoxville Jazz Orchestra. I make them produce events on their own, and we then talk about all of the different things you have to do to create a successful event; how to plan and make a budget, do a press release, get contracts that you need, all those kinds of things to put in place.
I then invite guest speakers to talk about things that I have less experience in, but other people in the area do.
DON, WHAT DID YOU LEARN IN “THE SCHOOL OF ART BLAKEY” THAT YOU PASS ON TO YOUR STUDENTS IN TENNESSEE?
DON BROWN: I learned about being professional, playing at a consistent level every night, and not only knowing the history of my own instrument, the piano, but the history of the music itself.
Art led by example, so one of the things that I got from him was how to lead a band, how to conduct rehearsals and prepare for gigs. Lots of intangible things like that; the way he conducted himself in public, the way he would play, but most importantly was respect for the history of the music and the importance of passing it on to the next generation.
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“I got from (Art Blakey) was…the way he would play, but most importantly was respect for the history of the music and the importance of passing it on to the next generation”
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DON: WHAT MADE YOU DECIDE TO STOP TOURING AROUND IN A JAZZ GROUP AND START TEACHING AT A UNIVERSITY LIKE TENNESSEE?
DON BROWN: It just kind of happened. I was playing in a Top 40 band in 1981 and were closing in on a record deal, but I was about to lose my house in Memphis, so I got a job first at Berklee. While I was touring in Japan the University of Tennessee wrote and asked me if I’d be interested in teaching there. They still allowed me to tour with other bands, as I toured with Blakey’s band with the Marsalis brothers and Billy Pierce, and returned to Art Blakey’s band in 1986, when the band had Kenny Garrett and Wallace Roney.
DON, YOU ALSO WORKED ON KENNY GARRETT’S SOLO ALBUMS
DON BROWN: I produced several of his cds, in fact we’re working on a new one. We started it back in December, but Kenny got to touring, so we’re working on getting our schedules together to finish it.
DON, YOU BROUGHT UP FINANCES AND MUSIC-ONE OF THE FRUSTRATING THINGS ABOUT MUSIC EDUCATION IS THAT IT CAN TAKE AN ENTIRE CAREER TO PAY FOR THE HIGH COST OF TUITION!
DON BROWN: Some of these schools may be prestigious, but from a faculty standpoint they didn’t pay well at all. That’s what made me go to Tennessee; the faculty at Berklee went on strike and I knew I wanted to get out of there.
The position at the U of T was originally for Ellis Marsalis, which was then offered to James Williams. He wasn’t interested, but he told them about me. Jerry Coker, who started the Jazz program at U of T, and I worked at the Jamie Aebersold camps, and he remembered me and hired me. I’m retiring this year.
DON, CAN A JAZZ MUSICIAN MAKE A GOOD LIVING WITHOUT BEING A TEACHER TO SUPPLEMENT HIS INCOME?
DON BROWN: You definitely can do it; there are many examples from Kenny Garrett to (the late) Wallace Roney and Johnny O’Neal. Some guys went to school and didn’t finish; others like Garrett didn’t go at all. He grew up in the Detroit jazz scene was like going to school when you’ve got guys like Marcus Belgrave who was a mentor to him, along with Geri Allen. Detroit had such a rich jazz legacy; that was a school of its own.
VANCE: IT SEEMS LIKE SO MANY OF THESE SCHOOLS LIKE BERKLEE AND MANHATTAN ARE SO EXPENSIVE, YOU’RE LUCKY IF YOU HAVE A CAREER THAT CAN PAY OFF THE TUITION FEES. SOMETIMES JAZZ EDUCATIONS SEEMS LIKE A PONZI SCHEME, WHERE THE ONLY WAY TO MAKE A LIVING IN JAZZ IS TO TEACH OTHERS TO PLAY IT.
VANCE: (laughs). Yes, you can think of it that way. I don’t think of it that way myself.
For one, a lot of the people who teach at our school are not going to go on to be professional musicians. The general music classes are more of an Appreciation class, introducing people to the art form and explaining to them what to listen for, how does it work.
In terms of the actual music majors who can’t go on to music careers-
I happen to think that there are a lot of things that you get out of studying music that are transferable to other things. Your degree may not be transferable, but your skills are.
One of the good things about studying a musical instrument is that it exercises a part of your brain where you have a goal in mind, and you can see the different steps that are between where you want to be and where you are right now.
By practicing over many years, you build up your ability to work on something and master it. That’s a skill that is transferable to almost anything.
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“I happen to think that there are a lot of things that you get out of studying music that are transferable to other things. Your degree may not be transferable, but your skills are”
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VANCE, THAT IS ONE OF THE MAJOR REASONS I STILL PRACTICE MY SAXOPHONE, EVEN THOUGH I AM TERRIBLE AT IT AND HAVE A DIFFERENT PROFESSION.
VANCE: Another benefit of music school is that while no one likes a Musicology Class, those classes help you work on your critical thinking skills and your writing skills. You have to write papers in those classes, and the reason why students hate those Musicology classes is because those teachers are usually sticklers for good writing, and making sure that you are formulating your thoughts in a logical manner, and that your sentences and paragraphs are grammatically correct. Being able to express yourself in writing is another kind of fundamental skill that we use as adults all of the time.
You don’t necessarily use these skills as a professional musician, although you might in terms of promoting your gigs. But, you can go into lots of other areas of professional work and have those writing skills benefit you.
VANCE, ONE OF THE HARDEST THINGS I’VE EVER DONE WAS AN ASSIGNMENT BY MY MUSIC TEACHER WHERE I HAD TO WRITE OUT MY OWN SOLO FOR “I REMEMBER YOU”.
VANCE: The piece of paper that you get at the end for the music degree is worthless, let’s be honest. No one hires you because they looked you up and you have a degree. But the skills are transferable to a lot of different areas.
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“The piece of paper that you get at the end for the music degree is worthless, let’s be honest. No one hires you because they looked you up and you have a degree. But the skills are transferable to a lot of different areas”
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BOTH DON AND VANCE, WHAT IS THE BIGGEST THING YOU TRIED TO CONVEY TO THE STUDENTS?
DON BROWN: The same stuff that I learned from Art Blakey. I was fortunate enough to be able to travel around in a band while also teaching, so my students also got to see me perform with a lot of different artists. I always say that the best teachers are also students. When I was teaching at Berklee I was also playing with Freddie Hubbard off and on and with Johnny Griffin, and my students would be excited to come to my gigs and see me play with them. Boston had such a rich jazz scene, between Berklee and the New England Conservatory.
The biggest reward for me is teaching; it’s like being a parent, and I have four kids myself. When I see them play it’s a reflection of my self. Cyrus Chestnut was one of my students; I got him his first professional gig. Danilo Perez was also one of my students
I’ve done something like sixteen albums; all but two of them were done while I was a teacher at Knoxville. Greg Tardy is also teaching at the school; he’s doing the same thing teaching and doing a little travelling. All of this opens doors for the students.
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“that the best teachers are also students”
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VANCE:For the music students, I’m just trying to help them get their fundamentals together, and not skip over anything.
We have a tendency towards instant gratification; we want everything right now. I’m just as guilty as anyone else. But the only way to really get good to where you can express yourself and the music on a high level is to make sure that all of the fundamentals are sound. You need to have not just intellectual knowledge, but also an actual practical knowledge of the harmonic system. With that, you can play all of the sounds of western harmony on your instrument well. You won’t have to think about “what notes are in that chord”; it’s a matter of your body actually where to find those sounds.
Those are fundamental skills that need to be addressed. Then you have to address learning repertoire and being so familiar with the music that you know where it’s coming from, who the important players are, what they played like, how to swing, how to play together in an ensemble.
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“the only way to really get good to where you can express yourself and the music on a high level is to make sure that all of the fundamentals are sound”
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VANCE, WHAT IS THE BIGGEST THING YOU AND THE SPEAKERS TRY TO CONVEY?
VANCE:The biggest thing I try to convey to them is that they have the power to take control of their own destiny.
If you are a player, it’s not a good idea to just sit around waiting for somebody else to hire you to play the music you want to play. If you’re a player with something specific that you want to play, there’s nothing in this day and age standing in the way of you just doing it.
DON, WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU LEAVE?
DON BROWN: Eric Reed is going to be taking my place. That’s great not only for the university, but for the Knoxville music scene.
I was in New York and heard the Ralph Peterson Jazz Messenger Legacy Band and heard Eric with his band. He and the band sounded magnificent.
I remember the first time I met Eric. He had just joined Wynton Marsalis’ band at eighteen, and they played in Knoxville. When I heard them in person I thought “Man, they weren’t exaggerating about this guy; he was smoking!” He’s one of my favorite players, so it’s going to be exciting with him here.
I can leave with a clean conscience (laughs)
DON;YOUR MOST RECENT ALBUM WITH THE KNOXVILLE JAZZ ORCHESTRA IS EXCELLENT. HOW DID YOU GET GUYS LIKE ERIC REED, WILL BOYD AND GREGORY TARDY TO COME ABOARD?
DON: Will lives here in Knoxville, and has been in the band for 10-15 years. Greg Tardy is a guy who travels all over the world and plays with big name people; he lives here and teaches at the university.
He was a member of Bill Frisell’s band a number of years ago, but he quit touring as a jazz musician, taking the job down here from New York. We hired Bill to play with the orchestra as a guest artist, and he reconnected with Gregory. They’ve been working together again since then.
VANCE, DO MUSICIANS LIKE BILL FRISELL SPEAK TO THE STUDENTS AS WELL AS PLAY?
VINCE:Yes, Bill gave an excellent Master Class. He’s a super humble guy; he told them “I’m just like you guys; I’m still trying to figure it out, I’ve just been working at it longer”. He made all of us feel a little better.
ERIC REED IS A FOUNTAIN OF KNOWLEDGE. WHAT DID HE HAVE TO SAY?
VANCE: Eric was great to work with. We had brought him in one time before with a concert of Thelonious Monk’s music. It was fun to work with him.
We had the arrangements from that concert, and when it was time to record them, I called him and asked if he’d come back and do them. He said “Absolutely”.
Subsequently, Donald Brown announced his retirement from teaching at UT, and we were able to offer his job to Eric. He will be moving here next fall.
BOTH DON AND VANCE:, WHAT ARE YOUR FUTURE GOALS?
DON BROWN: Try to get healthy; I’ve had problems with my hands performing so much the past two years. I’ve had problems with my rotator cuff and some surgeries on my hands. I’m now doing physical therapy for the damaged ligaments and nerves. That’s’ the game plan so I can get back out there performing. I want to write some books and do some instructional videos. I’m really looking forward to feeling better and getting back to performing.
VANCE: The biggest thing that I’m trying to grapple with right now is that the band has been going for 20 years, and I don’t want it to go away when I finally go away. If I went away tomorrow, it would be a struggle for it to keep going. I want to get the organization to a place where it doesn’t need me at all.
VANCE:WHAT MOTIVATES YOU TO KEEP YOU GOING?
VANCE: There’s an intrinsic motivation in the work itself. It is very rewarding. The teaching is rewarding in the sense of seeing the students progress, and I can be there for the “Aha” moments. They make a breakthrough and say, “This is what I’m supposed to be doing! I can actually do it!” That is selfish fun to be a part of that.
Getting to play the music is rewarding. Getting to meet and work with high level musicians that are our heroes, and getting to know them as people is very rewarding.
Because we’ve developed a local audience, the people here now appreciate that what we are doing is enriching their lives. For my job, I get thanked a lot more than a lot of other people in other professions.
Being a jazz musician and a presenter of music is not a thankless job. People appreciate it and thank you for doing it. That’s what makes me want to continue.
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“For my job, I get thanked a lot more than a lot of other people in other professions”
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ONE THING THAT IS ALWAYS FUN ABOUT LIFE IS THAT IT IS COMPLETELY UNPREDICTABLE. I DOUBT THAT ANYONE READING THIS ARTICLE WOULD HAVE PREDICTED THAT KNOXVILLE TENNESSEE WOULD HAVE A BURGEONING JAZZ EDUCATIONAL SCENE, WITH STARS LIKE BILL FRISELL, GREG TARDY AND ERIC REED AMONG THE SAGES. THE KNOXVILLE JAZZ ORCHESTRA’S LATEST ALBUM, THE ROAD LESS TRAVELLED, INCLUDES ALL THREE JAZZ VETS AS WELL AS FUTURE STARS. CHECK IT OUT, AND NEXT TIME YOU’RE LOOKING FOR SOMETHING TO DO AFTER TASTING SOME DRY RUB BBQ AND RIDING THE WHITEWATERS, TAKE IN A BIG BAND GIG IN SWINGING KNOXVILLE.