OH, YOU MAY NOT HAVE HEARD OF JOHN “JR” ROBINSON, AND SHAME (SHAME SHAME SHAME) ON YOU, BECAUSE YOU HAVE DEFINITELY HEARD HIM.
IF YOU DIDN’T TAKE IN HIS FAMOUS SESSION ON THINGS LIKE MICHAEL JACKSON’S OFF THE WALL, STEVE WINWOOD’S BACK IN THE HIGH LIFE OR COUNTLESS QUINCY JONES SESSIONS, YOU DEFINITELY DANCED TO HIS SONGS WHEN YOU WORE POLYESTER SLACKS IN THE DISCO DAYS WHEN HE HIT THE DRUMS FOR CHAKA KHAN AND RUFUS.
ROBINSON HAS DONE COUNTLESS CLINICS AS WELL, BUT WHAT’S MOST INTERESTING TO DATE IS HIS LATEST BOOK, APTLY TITLED KING OF THE GROOVE, WHICH HAS HIM WRITING NOT SO MUCH ABOUT THE TECHNIQUE OF MUSIC, BUT THE SKILL OF LIFE. IT’S INSPIRING FOR NOT ONLY FOR DRUMMERS, BUT FOR THOSE THAT MIGHT BLUSH IF SOME TALKS ABOUT PAISTES.
WE HAD A CHANCE TO MEET UP WITH JR, AND ,WHO WAS, AS WITH HIS DRUMMING, INFECTIOUS.
YOU ARE PART OF THE LAST GENERATION THAT WAS TAUGHT BY MUSICIANS THAT ONLY KNEW SWING MUSIC. THAT MAKES A DIFFERENCE IN YOUR PLAYING> EVER OTHER TEACHER HAD BEEN “LEAVENED” BY ROCK MUSIC
That’s absolutely true.
When I was younger I started studying with Ed Soph, and when I went to Berklee it was Alan Dawson.
The younger ones that I have taught, and there are some famous names, still don’t totally get that
I remember Ed Soph telling me as a 16 year old student, “Just get rid of the other three ****limbs for a second, and just with your right hand play quarter note dotted eight sixteenth, and just play it. You should be able to run a band with just that rhythm of the ride cymbal movement.
TODAY, MOST DRUMMERS SEE SWING AS A SECOND LANGUAGE
I see these Herculean young bucks that look like they could run the high hurdles in ***record time playing the same stuff on the drums without a breath. Buddy Rich would have vomited, because the stuff that they’re playing is extraordinary with the Gary Chaffee polyrhythmical drum phrasing with Olympian fills are just unbelievable. But where’s the musicality, man? Where’s Philly Joe?
YOU JUST FINISHED A BOOK. WHAT’S THE BIGGEST TAKE AWAY YOU WANT READERS TO GET FROM IT?
First of all, I’m not teaching anymore.
My book was gearded towards non-drummers, just regular people. It’s a “feel good” book
It touches on my life story and things.
But as far as musicians go, the biggest thing is to listen to other people and to look in the mirror
Every day we wake up with challenges, insecurities and strifes. Things that block our progression as a human being trying to contribute to the world
When you wake up, sure, you’re a bit crusty and funky, but look in the mirror, because if you look inside your eyeballs, you see what God intended, and you need to make the best of that. For your whole life, whatever it is
Another thing you can take out of this book is to do what you love. It doesn’t have to be drums; fall in love with your work.
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“as musicians go, the biggest thing is to listen to other people and to look in the mirror… because if you look inside your eyeballs, you see what God intended, and you need to make the best of that. For your whole life, whatever it is”
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WHO TAUGHT YOU THAT?
It was bestowed upon my by my parents, Jack and Helen.
My dad was an optometrist who wrote children’s books, flew airplanes and the head of the Civil Defense Syste, also the head of the Amateur Radio thing and taught scuba diving.
He started me on piano when I was five, and I realized that I was way too young for this stuff. I wasn’t mathematically ready, so drums saved me at 7-8. Thank God!
My mom was always teaching me about big bands and playing me records
I think the combination of letting me be myself at a young age, but still getting dirty and shooting bows and arrows, growing up in the Midwest. Being a normal boy in Southwest Iowa.
I was reeled in; I was disciplined. If it was close to dinner time and I was out playing, my father could whistle and you could hear it a block away, so you better move your ass.
My father never hit me; I knew better! Maybe that’s why I was such a fast track runner.
So, when I heard the belt come out of the loops, you better get home and cleaned up.
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“My father never hit me; I knew better! Maybe that’s why I was such a fast track runner”
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DID YOU GROW UP WITH A RELIGION OR PHILOSOPHY THAT GAVE YOU A MORAL COMPASS?
I was always busy. I was always occupied. If I ever got bored, I’d steal my dad’s golf balls and rub them on the cement to open them up to see what was inside of them.That would take three hours.
Or, I’d get a roll of caps and borrow my dad’s hammer and try to blow up my fingers.
By the time I was in high school, I never had time for drugs. I was a jock, a three sport letterman. I played in the Iowa State University All Star game while also playing in the Iowa big band. I was busy!
After high school, when I moved to Boston, I was shell shocked. Why is everyone looking down at the cement? Why isn’t anyone saying “hello” to me?
I was hustling, but not playing in Boston for several months and getting frustrated
I ended up joining this Sicilian/Italian band in a beautiful club, and things started progressing.
After Berklee, I was gigging, but not enough, so I moved to New York where I wanted to “be the next Steve Gadd” like everyone else.
HOW DID IT GO?
I realized that there wasn’t much work in New York, and it’s expensive to live there
Thank God the break came with Rufus. I moved to Los Angeles, and everything changed.
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“By the time we’re playing, every chick at the party was on the dance floor. That is the goal”
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HOW ABOUT ANY FAITH OR RELIGION?
I grew up in a Congregational American Protestant church. I think I’m directly related to the head guy, John Robinson.(who was a pastor to the pilgrims)
That doesn’t mean that I’m a Bible thumper or something great
I think that there are times when each and every one of us needs to talk privately to Whomever this Being is. If you are truly grateful for your talent you have to give this Being credit.
Hence the tille of the book King of the Groove. Obviously there are a lot of guys that are great “groove” drummers, hundreds of them. I wondered if the title would hurt peoples’ feelings, but it didn’t
I give thanks to God daily. I presently don’t go to church
But when I first moved out here I became the head of the music department
at the Hollywood Congregational Church. It got a bit frustrating when they’d say “John, you’re going to run the Christmas Bell Choir” (laughs)
I do have a deep faith.
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“You know, we’re all in Karaoke bands, everyone one of us”
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WHAT’S THE BEST ADVICE SOMEONE HAS GIVEN YOU?
When I was 16, Souff used to talk about space.
You know, we’re all in Karaoke bands, everyone one of us.
When we go out and do our ‘live’ shows, are we all playing brand new material from Oz Noy? Not necessarily! (laughs)
Generally, when I work with someone, even at the Hollywood Bowl with Josh Groban or Michael Buble, we’re all doing songs that we’ve already done. It’s Karaoke.
I’ve seen drummers, even famous drummers just playing too much stuff over the songs. Maybe because A) theyr’e bored B) they don’t have the cognizant ability to simplify the groove to make it cater to the song or singer, or C) they’re just awful
So, if you know that there’s a break coming up on the song, stop. What do you do?
Choices are very important. If you don’t make the correct choice, you’ll step on the lead singer. If you step on the lead singer, it’s going to cause chaos.
Chaos will alter every other band member on stage
You might like the guitarists ideas on “Fire”, but they may not be good ones. Then, all of a sudden he’s over playing, then the bass player is overplaying
But if you lay down a foundation that lets everybody blend with you, it will enhance the total outcome of the song. That’s the key.
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“I’ve seen drummers, even famous drummers just playing too much stuff over the songs. Maybe because A) theyr’e bored B) they don’t have the cognizant ability to simplify the groove to make it cater to the song or singer, or C) they’re just awful”
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WHAT WAS YOUR BAPTISM BY FIRE?
I think it happens to all of us when we sit behind a drum kit.
I remember playing with Glenn Fry in a rock band the day The Eagles broke up. I was with him for a year
We were playing in some outdoor shed. I look over, and all I have is this Atlas Speaker adhered to an Atlas straight mic stand. It was moving and rattling; the speaker must have been 6 inches. All you heard out of the speaker was OOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
So, I took a drumstick and threw it at the monitor engineer, hitting him right between the eyes
I wasn’t the only one; Glenn was getting the same feedback, and he fired the guy.
We ended up re-hiring the guy, but his hair went from brunette to gray in one tour. (laughs)
Years ago, when I was playing in clubs in Boston, there was a great jazz drummer, Joe Hunt. He was like a white Elvin Jones. We used to hang out.
Joe would hire me to sub for him. There was a gal named Lynn Stewart, who was Chick Corea’s cousin. I did a lot of gigs with her trio
One night, I was playing in the band and we were smoking. I’m thinking “keep it simple; it’s a jazz trio”
All of a sudden I see Chick Corea come walking in with his wife and sit down to watch. Immediately, my adrenaline took over and I erased all of my discipline and I started over playing. I remember that moment.
Afterwards, Chick came up to me and I told him that it was an honor to play with him. “One day I’d like to play with you”
He looked at me and said “One day you will” I thought it was just jive.
Later, when I was found by Bobby Watson, “Hawk” Wolinski and Rufus with Chaka Khan in Cleveland, Ohio, there was a big billboard that said “Welcome Rufus and Chaka Khan”. I was there with my band there, and we were a hot funky band with a singer named Jana.
I had that exact same experience about over playing when famous people came into the club. This was a 3000 seat disco club, but this time I kept my cool and played my stuff.
Pretty soon, everyone stopped dancing, even Chaka and the band came and watched us. Hawk asked if they could sit in with me. Everyone in my band split, they all came up, and that was the new band.
I did it because this time I was myself.
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“I didn’t want to make a drum books. Drum books are boring, unless John Bonham rose from the dead and told some stories”
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SO, YOU FIT IN WITH ROCK, FUNK, JAZZ, QUINCY AND EVEN COUNTRY. HOW DO YOU GEAR UP TO FIT IN WITH THESE DIFFERENT STYLES?
I’ve always had the philosophy that I would rather be in 1000 bands than in one band my whole career.
Of course, I’m jealous that I wasn’t in The Beatles or Rush(laughs)
You need to be a chameleon of such. I happened to be a good big band drummer that has great time
So, when I get plugged into a situation, I listen to the music and adjust
I did all of those Toby Keith or Wynona records, they aren’t any different from any other kind of music that I’m playing. We just get different tones on the drums; I’m still playing my grooves. I’m just adjusting to the other players’ parts
…I could be thrust into a Milwaukee polka band, and it will be great.
I was invited to Quincy Jones’ birthday party, at some Beverly Hills mansion. He had a band, David Garfield and Karizma; I’m a guest, hanging with Kareem Abdul-Jabbar because I’m a basketball fan.
Quincy’s oldest daughter Jolie Jones says “you’ve got to get up there and start playing; the people look bored”. And this is no offence to my friend David, but I say “OK” and get on the drums and we do “Another Star” by Stevie Wonder
By the time we’re playing, every chick at the party was on the dance floor. That is the goal.
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“Chaos will alter every other band member on stage.You might like the guitarists ideas on “Fire”, but they may not be good ones. Then, all of a sudden he’s over playing, then the bass player is overplaying.But if you lay down a foundation that lets everybody blend with you, it will enhance the total outcome of the song. That’s the key”
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WHAT DO YOU LOOK FOR IN DRUMMERS?
It depends on what situation that they’re in
If there are a lot of wanna be Buddy Rich clones out there, I would suggest not to do that. Just be yourself, and make the band swing
YOU’VE TALKED ABOUT DRUMMERS. WHAT DO YOU LOOK FOR IN BASSISTS?
In my book King of the Groove, I have a section on bass players. I apologize for any I left out, but I included bass players from even the very first band that I played in when I was twelve. He was Tony Seden, and he just played the last two strings of an electric guitar because nobody had basses in Iowa. (laughs)
If it weren’t for bass players, I wouldn’t know or feel how I play today. Bass players are the key
I have found some upright bass players audibly disturbing in trying to listen to them with their volume. It forced me to get to the studio way early to meet with the engineer and get a separate cue
But then, for example, I did Merle Haggard’s last album, and I’m playing with all of these heavy Nashville dudes. We were all in one cue, but because it was all so light and perfect, it sounded great.
I’ve done about ten records with Stanley Clarke. He and I are threatening to put a rock band togteher
I’m doing Stanley Clarke’s record right now; I’ve done about ten records with Stanley Clarke. He and I are threatening to put a rock band together. WE’ve written a song during COVID and it’s really good
I love Stanley, I was in Clarke/Duke and we had a number one record called “Sweet Baby”. He’d come up to me and show me his part with his playing, “ducka ducka duck”. It had a more muffled sound than a Bobby Watson-Marcus Miller “thunka thunka” vibe where the string speaks with the length of rhythm that you’re playing and it doesn’t overtake the drummer, but it blends with the bass drum part. That’s a bass player that listens
I love Stanley, but sometimes he has the propensity to be a guitar player. But that’s great; that’s Stanley Clarke
In 90% of the sessions I’ve done with Stanley outside of Clarke/Duke, we’d have another bass player in the session. We’d have Neil Stubenhaus or Alphonso Johnson and it would be fantastic. The best of both worlds
I prefer a bass player who knows that his role is similar to the drummer’s role
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I see these Herculean young bucks that look like they could run the high hurdles in record time playing the same stuff on the drums without a breath. Buddy Rich would have vomited, because the stuff that they’re playing is extraordinary with the Gary Chaffee polyrhythmical drum phrasing with Olympian fills are just unbelievable. But where’s the musicality, man? Where’s Philly Joe?
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YOU’VE PLAYED IN THE DORSEY SWING BAND. WHAT ADVANTAGE IS THERE BEING IN A BIG BAND?
I swear that there was some of Buddy Rich’s blood on Tommy Dorsey’s charts. The number of the charts went up to 900! I would hug the charts in order to absorb any “Buddy-ism” that I could. He ran that band.
I was only in it for a second
It was a ghost band, run by trombonist Warren Covington, and it featured some middle aged hottie. They’d omec out like the old Society Bands
Dick Bauman, one of my mentors and Jr. High band instructors had us win the Mid American Jazz Festival in 1969 in Omaha. He got me in that band
He introduced me to Warren Covington, who looked at me with my long rock hair, sizes me **up and said to me, “John, I don’t give a &%#@ what you p lay as long as you play one and three on the kick drum”. He takes my yellow band jacket and throws it in my face before turning around and walking away.
I guess he must have played with several drummers that stunk. So I did what he wanted and it was great.
I’m up on the stand, he shouts out. “OK, listen up! 21, 328, 910, 40 and 78”. So I’m looking through these old yellowed parts. He was a tyrant!
It made me realize that we take for granted the dues, hard work, stripes and stress that the previous generation of musicians went through just to make twenty five bucks. Today’s generation needs to study them
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“I swear that there was some of Buddy Rich’s blood on Tommy Dorsey’s charts. The number of the charts went up to 900! I would hug the charts in order to absorb any “Buddy-ism” that I could. He ran that band”
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WHICH DRUMMERS IMPRESS YOU THE MOST?
In my book, I’ve targeted five ‘A’ drummers that got me into Los Angeles so I could become the head of the studios
I dedicate information to each of these five drummers and how they inspired me
One was Steve Gadd. Another was Peter Erskine; a third was Billy Cobham; the fourth was Jeff Porcaro and the fifth was Ed Souff
I listened to what they did and how they were accomplishing things. I would listen to their albums and think “How could I have done that better? How would I have done it differently?”
It is not a drum book
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“If it weren’t for bass players, I wouldn’t know or feel how I play today. Bass players are the key”
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WHO’S MUSICAL MIND IMPRESSED YOU THE MOST?
Quincy Jones
First, he was the nicest human being I’ve ever met in my life
I met him when I was 23 and he was 40 something. He was wise. He was worldly. You don’t see color with Quincy
When I would get together with Quincy, he would say things like ‘Save that thing for your jazz record” (laughs) or “Leave your ego at the door” or “JR, you’re dancing too much” meaning I’m playing too much.
We’re at the Superdome in New Orleans with James Ingram, Patti Austin and a beautiful band.
It was twenty minutes to show time, and Quincy goes “JR! Come here!”
I go to him, he makes me look up and says, “Do you see those people way up there? They don’t give a &$%@ what you’re playing on your high hat.” He just turned around and walked away. (laughs)
So, I played it simple; that’s all he wanted.
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“Quincy was the most generous. He could be on Mount Rushmore”
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Quincy would be the kind of guy that would talk to you, look at your wife and go “Man, you guys are going to have some beautiful babies.”
Every Christmas I looked forward to his card, because it would be like an accordion, unfolding so big that it couldn’t fit on the fireplace mantle. There were so many kids!
He could just be himself.
He did the forward to my book. We had a lot of Number One and Top Ten records.
He gave me, from the beginning of Michael Jackson’s album Off The Wall full control. He let me control the tempos; I never got cut off if I had an opinion, and a lot of my opinions stuck, At the end of my process for that album, I thanked him for giving me the chance to work out the whole thing. I’d never really watched it go through the end. Drummers usually just come in, do their thing and get out. He let me stay through the whole process, and he just said “It’s nothing, man”
I was an all state vocalist in Iowa, singing Brahms in my sophomore year in high school. I was a bass. I also sang in the church when I was younger, so I have some vocal knowledge
So, I’m listening to Michael Jackson sing, and I’m thinking “the second part is cool, but the third part sounds wrong. It’s a half step off” But I don’t say anything.
They then put the fourth part on and I see, “Now it makes sense”. I learned a whole lot
Quincy was the most generous. He could be on Mount Rushmore
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“we take for granted the dues, hard work, stripes and stress that the previous generation of musicians went through just to make twenty five bucks. Today’s generation needs to study them”
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DURING YOUR TIME WITH CHAKA KHAN, WHAT HIT YOU ABOUT CHAKA KHAN’S VOICE AND STYLE?
When I was in Berklee from 73-75, It was analogue world, and we’d go play inall of these different bands, so you’d have to learn a lof of different songs and one played a lot of Rufs songs.as I loved the bans, Chaka wasn’t even the original singer; it was Paula Williams. But Chaka got in as a sixteen year old; there was something about that voice. Her range and her control of it reminded me of great horn players like Charlie Parker or Miles Davis.
I saw her on the cover of PEOPLE magazine back in 78 and thought “God, she’s gorgeous” and then BOOM I w as in the band
Once we started playing together, they realized that there was a synchronicity between us that will allow us to be taking risks, going for the throat.
We were not unlike a Led Zeppelin type, we were the next R&B funk rock band. I’m stillworking on a concept of doing a docu series with the past Rufus members. You’ve got to do it quick, because everyone’s getting up ther.She’a also finishing up a leg of her career. Just listen to some of her vocals on “Holy Fire” Holy $*W&*!
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“If there are a lot of wanna be Buddy Rich clones out there, I would suggest not to do that. Just be yourself, and make the band swing”
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WHAT GOALS DO YOU NOW HAVE?
Getting my book out has been a two year goal, so we’re now promoting it.
It was harder than making an album. My producer Ally Mang worked hard on where to go with it.
I didn’t want to make a drum books. Drum books are boring, unless John Bonham rose from the dead and told some stories
I have a study right now in my house. I’m a keyboard player and producer, and knowing that the book is done I had a great joy
The Kansas City Chiefs give me great joy, with a three peat being great.
HOW CAN YOU SAY SUCH A THING TO A RAIDERS FAN BACK FROM THE DARYL LAMONICA/FRED BILETNIKOFF DAYS?
Those were the golden days, and I still love the Raiders!
I’m now looking a doing a third solo record.
I’ve been writing since COVID; I’ve even written a song about, everything, even my washing machine,It’s smoking. Its pure funky Zappa
I Have desires to make a rock record but we’ll sell.
I want to give a shout out to my publicist Chrity DiGirolamo, who got me this interview,and my manager Brian McKenna.We are putting together “JR Robinson Experience” which is to be touring at PACs and Wineries . It goes back to the Karaoke concept; a six piece Rufus styled Chaka band. I’m already looking at the correct players; it will be really good. We’ll be doing several of my hits
We’ll be doing lectures off of the book . We’ve started a charity fund Music Through Arts.On this book release we’ll take x amount of dollars per book sale, and start depositing it into a fund, which will than help kids.
If you live in California , you notice thatt that ere are not a large number of arts programs in public schools, dancing or any sort of art.We’re going to try to expand on that and help the kids who need gear and direction
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“Once we started playing together, they realized that there was a synchronicity between us that will allow us to be taking risks, going for the throat”
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SO, IF YOU WANT TO LEARN ABOUT MUSIC, CHECK OUT JR’S WORK ON HIS COUNTLESS SESSIONS. IF YOU WANT TO LEARN ABOUT LIFE, GRAB A COPY OF HIS LATEST BOOK. EITHER WAY, YOU’LL LIKE THE GROOVE.