A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO IN AN INTERVIEW, PIANIST BILL CHARLAP CONFIDED IN ME, “I’M THE SECOND BEST PIANIST IN THE FAMILY”, REFERRING TO HIS WIFE RENEE ROSNES.
SHE INITIALLY GOT MY ATTENTION WHEN SHE WAS PART OF JOE HENDERSON’S “ALL FEMALE RHYTHM SECTION” WAY BACK IN THE DAY. SHE HAS BEEN IN BANDS LED BY JJ JOHNSON AND WAYNE SHORTER, TO NAME JUST A FEW.
HER OWN CATALOGUE IS EQUALLY IMPRESSIVE, WITH HER LATEST, KINDS OF LOVE SHOWING NOT ONLY THE DEPTH OF HER PLAYING, BUT ALSO COMPOSING SKILLS.
SHE’S RECENTLY BEEN ON TOUR WITH ARTEMIS, AN ALL-FEMALE BAND THAT RECENTLY RELEASED ITS SECOND ALBUM, AND IT IS STRONG ENOUGH TO GO MANO A MANO WITH ANY CHALLENGER.
WE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO GET TO KNOW MS. ROSNES, WHO, LIKE HER MUSIC, IS CONFIDENT, CURIOUS.
I HOPE I DON’T GET ON THE WRONG FOOT WITH YOU, BUT YOU HAVE DONE SOMETHING THAT IS ADMIRABLE, AS FEW WOMEN DO IT; YOU’VE LET YOUR HAIR GO GRAY. WAS THAT A CONSCIOUS DECISION?
Absolutely it was a conscious decision.
I started going gray in my thirties.
About a year before the pandemic happened, I decided “enough is enough” and didn’t care enough to keep dying my hair. I was just ready to do it.
I can’t tell you what a relief it is not to have to dye my hair; I actually think it’s quite becoming! I think that there are now more and more women who are letting that happen, just as men do.
And it doesn’t have to be dowdy; it can be attractive.
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“(Joe Henderson) taught through his horn”
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I’VE ALWAYS FELT THAT WOMEN NEED A COUNTERPART TO CLINT EASTWOOD. YOU CAN LOOK GOOD AGING NATURALLY
Yes. There are a lot of move stars now. You think of Helen Mirren or Andie MacDowell, and even Meryl Streep have gone in that direction. It’s not as unusual anymore, as it was even a few years ago.
BEING IN YOUR CURRENT BAND ARTEMIS IS NOT YOUR FIRST EXPERIENCE AS SUCH. YOU WERE IN JOE HENDERSON’S BAND THAT HAD AN ALL LADY RHYTHM SECTION BACK IN THE DAY. WAS THAT COINCIDENCE OR A CONSCIOUS DECISION BY HIM?
I think Joe Henderson did that consciously
As far as I could figure out, he wanted to give some young women with promise an opportunity to play and tour with him.
Joe had more than one band utilizing various female instrumentalists. Early on of course, he worked a lot with pianist Joanne Brackeen. When I came on board, there was a quartet with drummer Cindy Blackman––who is now Cindy Blackman-Santana––and New York bassist Kim Clarke.
After that, Joe hired the Chicago bassist Marlene Rosenberg and drummer Sylvia Cuenca. I remember that last quartet played a week with him at the Village Vanguard during August of 1987 and also made a few European tours. Playing with Joe in my mid-20’s was my entrance into the larger world of international touring
WAS THAT A KIND OF BAPTISM BY FIRE?
I didn’t think of it like then, but looking back on it, it was, in a way. He was a major jazz star, one of my heroes. To be able to make music with him night after night was just thrilling and an incredible experience.
I was fortunate enough to continue working with him along with other male musicians like Larry Grenadier and George Mraz on bass, as well as drummer Al Foster. A lot of great musicians.
I even did a week with Joe in LA at Catalinas with Charlie Haden and Tootie Heath
WHAT WERE THE BIGGEST THINGS THAT YOU GLEANED FROM BEING WITH HENDERSON?
He taught through his horn
He wasn’t a big talker. What I learned was a lot about focus and consistency from night to night, just the sheer brilliance of his playing. He maintained such a high level at all times.
That was a great learning experience for me, just to be accompanying him and listening to him, learning from his actual vocabulary, his phrasing and also how to put a set together. It was great.
YOU’RE NOW IN AN ALL FEMALE BAND; IS THERE A DIFFERENT MUSICAL DYNAMIC WITH A MALE LEADING AN ALL FEMALE BAND?
No. For me its all about the music
The anatomy that someone has doesn’t play a role in their musicianship. Somebody is either accomplished or not accomplished.
Playing now with Artemis, there was no differentiation in terms of the fact of our gender
THERE ARE NO XX CHORDS OR XY SCALES
Absolutely.
Wayne Shorter once told me “music transcends gender”
There was no difference either with a man being the leader of the band. Everyone is an individual.
I’ve been in many bands led by men, great men. Wayne Shorter, Joe Henderson, JJ Johnson, Bobby Hutcherson and James Moody.
Each person has their own personality and way of going about leading and with their own goals in mind.
It’s about the craft of the music.
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“When I told (Wayne Shorter) that (I couldn’t play the synthesizer), he said ‘It doesn’t matter; you can learn on the gig’”
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YOU PLAYED WITH WAYNE SHORTER. TELL MY HOW YOU FIRST MET AND PLAYED WITH HIM
I was living in Brooklyn at the time at a friend’s house, and received a call from Wayne Shorter.
My roommate had given him my phone number because he knew where I was across the street. This is obviously before cell phones. So, he passed on the phone number to Wayne.
I was extremely surprised. I thought of course that it was a joke.
He asked if I would be interested in joining a new band that he was putting together to make a tour.
I was thrilled, and immediately knew that this was something I wanted to do. I also felt that he needed to know that I wasn’t proficient on the synthesizer.
When I told him that, he said “It doesn’t matter; you can learn on the gig” (laughs)
I was amazed by that, and also happy. I knew that this was a challenge that I not only wanted to take on, but must take on, because you just can’t turn down that type of an opportunity.
The other thing that he asked me on that first phone call was if I had seen the movie Alien.
I replied that I hadn’t. He said “Don’t worry about it; when you come out to San Francisco to rehearse, we’ll watch it together as a band”.
Fast forward to that moment when we’re all watching that movie together in a friend’s living room…
There comes the part where the creature kind of erupts out of the chest of William Hurt. At that moment, Wayne took the remote control and stopped the film, exclaiming “You see that? That’s how I want my band to sound!” (laughs)
That was a great baptism!
As I got to know Wayne over the years, he would talk about the unknown, the unpredictability, the drama, the surprise, the element of just letting go and seeing what will happen. That is the way he lived his life, but also with the music he played. That was his motto.
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“There comes the part (in the movie Aliens) where the creature kind of erupts out of the chest of William Hurt. At that moment, Wayne took the remote control and stopped the film, exclaiming ‘You see that? That’s how I want my band to sound'”
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YOU HAD A LONG TIME WITH JJ JOHNSON. WAS THAT A TIME OF HONING YOUR BOP CHOPS?
I think I’m always honing my bop chops, up to this day.
He was the Father of bebop trombone, and it was a fantastic experience to make music with him night after night.
As with all of these masters that I’ve had the opportunity to play with, I cannot emphasize enough the level of consistency they all had. Every single time that they played, it was so completely focused and so the language so beautifully wrought.
There’s no other school like it, being able to play with people of that caliber. It rubs off on you in a way that you feel “I just have so much to still learn, so much to study”.
It’s never ending.
But it was never-ending for them, too.
There was a striving in all of them to continually improve. So, when the gig’s over, it doesn’t mean you just stop, and that’s it and you’re not thinking about music anymore.
I saw JJ many times in the airport, just warming up his mouthpiece for what was to be the concert later that day. I remember many evenings with James Moody where there might be a saxophonist in the house that he admired, and he’d ask him, the younger saxophonist about what he was doing. There he was, in his 80s and still thinking about how he can improve and what he can learn.
These are lifelong lessons that stick with you. There’s just a never-ending quest for bettering yourself. If you think you know it all, you don’t! (laughs)
That doesn’t mean that you still can’t sound amazing at whatever level that you’re at; it’s just that the music is there to challenge you. It can kick your butt sometimes (excuse my language), but you just have to get up again and tell yourself that you’re going to conquer it.
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“with all of these masters that I’ve had the opportunity to play with, I cannot emphasize enough the level of consistency they all had. Every single time that they played, it was so completely focused and so the language so beautifully wrought”
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SPEAKING OF CONQUERING A CHALLENGE, HOW MUCH DO YOU HAVE TO CHANGE IN YOUR PLAYING TO ACCOMPANY A VOCALIST LIKE RENEE FLEMING OR TONY BENNETT?
That’s another ballgame altogether
You play the music; you play what’s required at that time for who you’re working with. There’s nothing I consciously do to change anything. As a musician who’s listening and thinking about how I best support what’s happening in the moment. How can I best support this person? Whether it’s an instrumentalist or a vocalist, listening is the whole thing. What particular thing does that person need in order to make the piece of music successful? How can they best get their message across, with the lyrics and phrasing? They’re telling a story in a bit of a different way, because they have words.
Anything you can do to help that story get across to the audience is what you’re thinking about. You don’t want to be covering somebody up at a very important moment; you don’t want to be getting in the way of the lyric by playing too much, or not being attentive to the phrasing in such a way that maybe they can lay back here, or they want a chord there on the downbeat, or DON’T want the chord on the downbeat.
You have to be hyper-aware as to what it is that people want and need. Sometimes, they aren’t even vocal about it in terms of telling you what they want; it can be done through the music. That’s why your listening skills have to be paramount in those situations.
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“when the gig’s over, it doesn’t mean you just stop, and that’s it and you’re not thinking about music anymore”
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WHAT WAS YOUR IMPETUS FOR GETTING INTO THE SFJAZZ COLLECTIVE?
I was a founding member; I was in the first group of the collective. I stayed for six years.
I didn’t form the group; I was asked to join, so I had no role in terms of putting it together.
I believe Joshua Redman and Bobby Hutcherson were the ones to organize the whole thing.
It was a wonderful experience to make music with so many top level musicians such as Joshua Redman, Joe Lovano, Nicholas Payton, Dave Douglas, Stefon Harris, drummers and Brian Blade, were in the first group, with Robert Hurst on bass. Miguel Zenon on alto sax and Eric Harland on drums. Robin Eubanks.
Playing with Bobby Hutcherson in that context was really a beautiful thing.
I was used to playing with him in his own groups, which were usually quartets or quintets, but it’s a very different experience to come into a much larger band, looking at original material as well as various arrangements of various jazz compositions. I loved it.
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“There’s just a never-ending quest for bettering yourself. If you think you know it all, you don’t!”
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YOUR OWN ALBUMS AS A LEADER HAS OCCASSIONAL KEYBOARDS. DID YOUR SYNTHESIZER WORK WITH SHORTER OPEN THE DOOR FOR YOU TO PLUG IN AT TIMES SUCH AS THESE RELEASES SUCH AS KINDS OF LOVE?
I was just playing a Fender Rhodes that album, but that is different than playing synthesizer, with all sorts of choices of sounds. The Rhodes has just the “Rhodes Sound”, and I actually started playing that in high school, when I was first introduced to jazz. It’s been a sound in my head that I’ve loved for a long time.
That particular recording studio, Sear Sound in New York, they have an amazing collection of old keyboards. Besides the Fender Rhodes: the studio owns a Wurlitzer, a Hohner clavinet, a Moog Antique Theramin, a Baldwin Electric Harpsichord, and a Hammond B3 organ So the mere fact the Rhodes was available inspired me to use it on a few tracks
YOU HAVE QUITE A CATALOGUE; DO YOU EVER GO BACK TO ASSESS YOUR ALBUMS?
No. (laughs)
I might hear them on the radio. I don’t listen to my older recordings, or to myself much at all. I’m still performing some of the material from at least my last three albums. I still play “Galapagos”; in fact I play it with Artemis as well. But, I don’t go back and purposefully listen.
SPEAKING OF PURPOSEFULLY LISTENING, HOW IS THE DYNAMIC OF PLAYING WITH YOUR HUSBAND (BILL CHARLAP) ON AN ALBUM (DOUBLE PORTRAIT)?
That was like falling off of a rock!
It’s very easy, comfortable and a loving experience in our home living room, where I am right now. We have two Steinway Grand Pianos nested here.
We’re very busy, but sometimes we just sit down and play together. We hadn’t been doing it for awhile, due to the pandemic, but recently we did a run at the Jazz Forum Club, and in a few weeks we’ll be up in Vermont at the Vermont Jazz Center doing a two piano concert.
We have some other things coming up, like a week at Birdland.
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“Anything you can do to help that story get across to the audience is what you’re thinking about”
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WHEN YOU LISTEN TO A PIANO PLAYER, IS THERE ANYTHING YOU LISTEN FOR IN PARTICULAR?
Generally, when I’m listening to anything, I’m looking to enjoy it. I don’t try to pick it apart.
If it’s something that intrigues me and I’m attracted to it, I will analyze it as I’m listening.
I’m blessed with perfect pitch, so it’s easier for me to hear things. If I’m listening to someone and hear a particular voicing that I like, or a turn of a phrase that catches me, I’ll automatically turn on the antennas and think “what is that?”.
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“You have to be hyper-aware as to what it is that people want and need. Sometimes, they aren’t even vocal about it in terms of telling you what they want; it can be done through the music. That’s why your listening skills have to be paramount in those situations”
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IS THERE A MUSICIAN LIVING OR DEAD THAT YOU WOULD PAY $1000 TO SEE PERFORM?
Louis Armstrong would be great. I’d love to have seen Thelonious Monk, Art Tatum, Billie Holiday…that would be great.
I also come from the last generation of folks…the generation after me didn’t have the opportunity to see Dexter Gordon, Sarah Vaughan, Ella Fitzgerald , Oscar Peterson or Miles.
I saw and heard all of these people “live”, so I feel incredibly lucky to have had that experience.
My son Dylan (who’s in his mid-20’s now) is a very talented guitar player and singer/songwriter. He has an Indie rock band called “Tula Vera.” As he was growing up in his mid teens, he was interested in the playing of certain musicians.
When BB King came to town, I knew he was kind of no longer in his prime and it wouldn’t be the same kind of show that it would have been 20-30 years ago, but I knew that I had to take him. He needed to be exposed to this man. We went to see Paul McCartney together as well.
I’m very mindful of that, because these people aren’t going to be around forever.
IS THERE ANYONE IN HISTORY YOU WOULD LIKE TO SIT DOWN WITH AND PICK HIS OR HER BRAIN?
All of the people I just mentioned!
It would have been fascinating to have really known such creative giants as composers Igor Stravinsky, Dmitri Shostakovich, Bela Bartok, or artists Pablo Picasso, Salvador Dali, Canadian painter Emily Carr, or the iconic architect Frank Lloyd Wright. I was just in Bern, Switzerland and attended an exhibition of the painter and sculptor Joan Miró. It was so interesting to learn about his process and the different ways in which he worked.t.
There is just so much interesting art in the world; not just in music, but film work as well. There is just so much to see and digest which can inform and inspire my own work.
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“There is just so much to see and digest which can inform and inspire my own work”
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ARE THERE ANY BOOKS THAT YOU’VE READ THAT YOU WISH OTHER PEOPLE WOULD READ?
I love biographies and non-fiction books. It’s the same with films; I love documentaries
Canadian born cognitive psychologist Steven Pinker explores the debate between genetics and environment in shaping one’s behavior and personality: nature versus nurture. Being an adopted person who connected with my maternal biological family in my mid-thirties, I’m intrigued by this topic.
Ernest Hemingway A Moveable Feast: Hemingway’s beautifully written memoir about his days in Paris—before he was famous—from the early to mid 1920’s, with insights about his first marriage, his creative life, and candid stories about his complex relationships with American expats F. Scott Fitzgerald, his wife Zelda, Gertrude Stein and Ezra Pound among others. I loved reading about the artistic energy and the romance of Paris after World War I.
Arthur Taylor-Notes and Tones: An enlightening book of interviews led by the great drummer Art Taylor, who documented conversations with his friends who were also legendary musicians including Sonny Rollins, Miles Davis, Betty Carter, Kenny Dorham and Nina Simone among many greats. The topics are music-related but also span social issues, race, and the music business. It’s a must-read for any student of the music.
Jhumpa Lahiri Interpreter of Maladies:In this collection of short stories, Jhumpa Lahiri recognizes both the dichotomies and the cross cultural alchemy between the two worlds of the East Indian and American cultures. Since the discovery of my own Punjabi heritage, I’ve been interested in reading stories concerning the Indian immigrant experience.
Alec Wilder-American Popular Song: The Great Innovators: The most important book on the masters of American popular songwriting from the point of view of another major songwriter (one whose music I love and have recorded), with his point of view, personality and tremendous wit intact. There’s no other book in its class—before or since.
IS THERE ANY RELIGION, PHILOSOPHY OR TEACHING THAT HAS INSPIRED OR MOTIVATED YOU?
Not particularly.
I grew up in Canada, and went to the Anglican church. I didn’t follow through with that.
For awhile I was into Buddhism and was reading about it. I feel that all religions should be respected and that there is a Higher Power. There are a lot of different names for that Higher Power.
WHAT GIVES YOU THE MOST JOY?
Being with my kids, being with (husband) Bill, having a great time on stage playing some great music. Cooking, gardening, being in nature…
I’m from the province of British Columbia but was born in the prairies, in Regina, Saskatchewan. I was adopted from an orphanage at the age of five months, and my adoptive parents brought me west to North Vancouver, which is where I grew up, and is the place I consider my hometown.
I actually got to meet my biological mom who is in her 90s now, and I have a whole bunch of biological relatives that I didn’t know about before. I met them in the mid-90s, so I’ve known them for quite a while now.
It’s been wonderful because my son has grown up with my biological relatives as if I have; he has a lot of cousins, aunts and uncles and grandparents that are true to his blood. My mom and dad who raised me passed away many years ago, so it’s been lovely to have them in my life.
It’s also been interesting: when I met my biological mom, I learned that I’m half Punjabi! My mom is Punjabi; they are Sikhs. That was an eye opener, and a lovely thing in my life to have a whole new culture.
She was born in Canada, and her parents were born in India, coming over in 1912
WHAT FUTURE GOALS DO YOU HAVE?
Just get better and keep making great music.
I’m very excited about the new Artemis album, In Real Time. It has a bunch of new material on it, and also has one of Wayne Shorter’s pieces, “Penelope”.
I’m just happy to be playing out here; grateful to have my health. I’m a very lucky person; I have a lot of love around me and also great music and friends.
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“I’m just happy to be playing out here; grateful to have my health. I’m a very lucky person; I have a lot of love around me and also great music and friends”
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THE THE WORLD OF JAZZ HAS BEEN ENHANCED BY RENEE ROSNESS, AS SHE’S HAS TAKEN IN THE GIFTS THAT SHE’S RECEIVED FROM HER MENTORS AND IS NOW AT THE STAGE OF HER CAREER AND LIFE WHERE SHE CAN PASS THEM ON. AS ONE WHO IS ALWAYS LOOKING FORWARD IN BOTH LIFE AND MUSIC, SHE IS ABLE TO MAKE NEW DISCOVERIES ABOUT BOTH THE WORLD AND HERSELF.
IF YOU ARE ABLE TO, CATCH HER ON TOUR WITH ARTEMIS AND TAKE IN THE SOUNDS THAT SHE HAS IMBIBED AND IS READY TO PASS ON TO YOU. AS A TEACHER ONCE TOLD ME, “SOME THINGS ARE BETTER CAUGHT THAN TAUGHT”. LIKE THE BEST OF FISHERMEN, RENEE ROSNES CATCHES AND RELEASES.